A lot of things are happening at the moment. Here are some news to keep you up to date.
LXDE
I would like to thank all the people who commented and sent us their feedback on Linux Mint 11 LXDE RC. Althought we were and we’re still really happy with the quality of this release, the fact that it sporadically failed to load X from the live session for many people was identified as a serious problem and a release breaker. We switched LXDM to GDM as the default login manager and we believe this addresses the problem. However, due to the fact that this bug wasn’t always reproducible, we need your feedback again and so we decided to release another RC before going stable.
Linux Mint 11 LXDE RC2 should be out early this week.
KDE
Linux Mint 11 KDE has been in testing for a couple of weeks and during its testing a couple of design decisions were made, including important changes in the software selection and the look and feel. The lack of performance and the amount of resources needed by the Kubuntu base were identified as an issue, along with a regression in the installer affecting the detection of other operating systems. Although we’re close to a release in terms of quality, a discussion is ongoing about the possibility of switching the KDE edition to LMDE. This would give it the performance it needs and make KDE a viable alternative on mid-spec computers.
Depending on this discussion, we could see a Linux Mint KDE 11 RC release this month, or an LMDE-based rolling Linux Mint KDE RC some time in August.
LMDE
We were planning the following for LMDE:
- Improving the way people roll and update their system
- Improving the installer
- Improving the way people install proprietary drivers
- Re-spinning the ISOs
We made really good progress on the Update Manager, the update packs and the new repositories and we’re now focused on improving the installer.
The installer now detects your language automatically and lets you choose keyboard variants as well as layouts and models. We’re just started with the installer and more improvements should follow.
Because of breakages in Debian Testing between MESA and proprietary drivers we won’t work on improving the way people install them this time around. This is something we’re planning to do in the future, and whether it’s by porting Jockey from Ubuntu to Debian or by making a better alternative ourselves, we will tackle this at some stage. But for now, after the installer is ready we’ll work on respinning new LMDE ISOs for Gnome and Xfce before focusing on Linux Mint 12.
Some decisions are hard to make and I appreciate the fact that people are waiting and that nobody likes to see a release delayed or a design decision changing something people like. This is for the best though, and with the quality of our desktops in mind. A restrospective look at a release, the fun people have with it and the pride we have in having delivered it.. it’s all to do with quality. This is the reason we do not announce release dates and the reason even though these two editions have been in testing for respectively 3 and 4 weeks, we’re not releasing them yet. I hope you understand and I would like to thank everybody for their patience.
Our testing is public and you can follow it at http://community.linuxmint.com/iso
If you’re interested, you can also follow our progress on the installer at https://github.com/linuxmint/live-installer/commits/master
As usual Clem, you are the voice of common sense amidst the heat of the debates regarding the direction of Linux Mint. I’m confident that whatever you decide will be the best for the distribution. The past record of the popularity of Mint is a testament to your good judgement.
“and with the quality of our desktops in mind.” You’ve earned that. Keep up the good work, and keep letting us know how we can help.
Hope next release will also fix the openoffice quick launch that prevent mint to shutdown.
Anyway, I’m so curious to the look and feel of KDE version.
First of all, thank you. Mint has made it possible for me to install Linux for many people who would not want Linux in their computers. This is because it works. I don’t like when people say that some product is good because it’s easy to use or it looks like another product. The truth is that when something works, everything is easy, Mint works.
LMDE works even better, I install LMDE’s in very old computers (mainly in Nepal) so hardware compatibility is very important. Stability is even more important as the people that I’m talking about don’t have internet connections. With LMDE I can leave them the repos on DVD. So if extra software is needed…….
I have two questions. Would it be possible for you guys to put together a “No internet Mint”? It’s easy enough to give someone (a school) a computer but almost impossible to get them an internet connection……A stand alone CD (small, without internet stuff) and a downloadable repository
would make it possible for Mint to grow in the mountains…….
And the second question, could you guys write some sort of quick tutorial on the lines of “This is the most stable Mint posible” for those of us that need our desktops to work all the time and don’t have an internet connection?
Thanks again.
I think that the mint welcome screen is the best feature of the OS, giving you the option to upgrade to the DVD is great something that is missing in Ubuntu. It would be nice id you could be offered to use DockbarX as default or the windows lis.
Feels great to be a Mint user, announcements like this informing about the progress, listening to user feedback, incorporating/bringing in changes for an overall great experience, all sums up into a great community based distro. It’s tough to please everyone, but you guys are doing a phenomenal job.
Now if you could make LXDE/XFCE even more leaner by removing unwanted gnome dependencies (slim for example instead of gdm), it would be great :wink. And would be really happy if Mint-E17 (on Debian base of course) were to be launched 😀
Thanks again for a nice distro.
Clem,
Is there any word on the next version of the Fluxbox edition? Is that even on the radar at this point? Or has it quietly faded away?
I don’t know why, Mint doesn’t want anymore to base Ubuntu, I don’t know if this is a real strategy to be free, incompetence or unwillingness. In Brazil, BIG Linux 11.04 RC2 (based on Kubuntu 11.04) is working very (with all compiz effects, cube etc) well like a final version and is a distro without a team and money.
Great communication, and an even better distro. I like the LMDE KDE idea and think it would be well worth the wait for the RC. As always, great work Mint team!
After trying different distro’s I’ve returned to good old Mint 🙂 and I must confess that LXDE 11 RC1 runs just great here. I’ve tried LMDE but kept running on update problems, even after a couple of tries so I’m gonna stay with LXDE from now on. One question though = I’d like to see a Debian version of Mint LXDE, is there any chance a Debian version is going to make its appearance in the near future ?
Besides that : keep up the great work !
If the Linux Mint KDE change to Debian base, it be a rolling distro like XFCE and LMDE? If yes, that is a great idea. I alredy use the KDE edition base ubuntu but change to Aptosid KDE version. I think that Linux Mint KDE with Debian base could be a nice system.
Glaaaaaaad to se the progress going!
Mint is DEFINITELY turning to a SERIOUS and EXCELLENT project.
Keep up the good work!
@Carlos Felipe — I’m interested in Mint primarily because it gives me a great option to move away from an Ubuntu base. I’m very much enjoying all the minty-goodness, but I wouldn’t be here at all if it wasn’t for LMDE, and if that disappeared, I’d be off elsewhere at my earliest convenience 🙂 If you want Kubuntu (and personally, I really don’t), install Kubuntu.
@Clem — very pleased to see the direction you’re taking LMDE. I hope it works, and I’ll do my best to do my bit to help make sure it does 🙂 Thanks!
Thanks for the update Clem!!!!!
Really liking LMDE & looking forward to it’s next respin….I’m ready to help.
@Simon, I install Kubuntu IF you install Debian, not LMDE ¬¬’
Mint will lose their users who wanted an easy system, a charming ubuntu,
to please a new audience that wants something more “spartan”.
I’m looking forward for the re-spin of the LMDE. I’m intending to install it on my new laptop, so a re-spin will be great!
And congratulations on the wonderful job!
And it will be nice to have a KDE version of LMDE too. Keep up!
Very interesting and unique,
Linux Mint with Gnome and
Linux Mint Debian Edition with KDE,
True choice for different desktop users.
I really think that mint will lose many users if Mint KDE is not ubuntu based…
why not both???
I’m all for switching KDE to a Debian base, and I believe the majority of your users are as well. I mean lets face it. It is most likely going to have to be changed eventually, given Canonicals direction. Why not change it now, and have extra time to work out the bugs.
Please don’t kill the kubuntu based mint KDE, i always wanted a lmde kde, but not as a replacement of buntu based. You also know debian testing is not suitable for everyone yet (i am convinced it will be soon, as you are going in such a direction that even debian might be get benefited), dont brake their heat!
I am against LMDE be the main project, LMDE works like a PLAN B, ready for replace Ubuntu anytime [..]
I use Mint since Mint 7, I was very sad with the end of universal edition, LMDE installer is only english too (as far as I know), Every day I’m more disappointed with this distro. They said they would not use the Banshee, but they are using, what they say is not always truth, so I think there is still hope.
Great job Clem.
Regarding the improvements in the installer, will one of those improvements be support for disk encryption? What about LVM?
Bring me linux mint openbox and I’ll be your Bitch forever!
I love mint with KDE but because of my intel pro wireless 4965 AG o AGN I am held in version 9 after that I don’t know what to do. I hope that in this release the software can recognize the drivers
@ Carlos Felipe,
Do you have any valid complaint whatsoever other than crying about how Mint is moving away from being based on Ubuntu?
If you love Ubuntu so much, then use it. For the rest of us sane users who want a reliable, stable desktop distro without being subjected to Canonical’s ridiculously incompetent decisions, Mint can’t switch over to a Debian base fast enough.
Please keep the Ubuntu based versions of Linux Mint I’ve Come to know and Love. :Furthermore I think people are losing sight of what Canonical has done with its O.E.M project by getting Laptops video cams and other items to work with Ubuntu. Which means if you buy a dell Laptop and its ready for Ubuntu it will also be ready for Linux Mint, Zorin,Pin Guy, peppermint and all other Ubuntu based Distros. Which is Mainly due to Canonical working with H.P Dell Sony etc etc.
@Luis Baquerizo, antes de terminar el soporte de Mint 9 (Abril de 2013), que es basada en una versión LTS, tendrás comprado probablemente otra compu, pero realmente odio cuando las cosas dejan de funcionar. El problema de muchos controladores/drivers es que son propietarios.
recently got familiar with KDE (always been reluctant so far) after a couple of years on gnome and i gotta say – like No_Asylum – a KDE switch to LMDE would be awesome…until then PCLinuxOS fulfills my KDE needs on a second computer
Any news on the Fluxbox version?
Clem, thanks so much for the progress report and as for KDE moving to Debian base … outstanding. I’ve been a Gnome fan for some time now, actually it was Mint that moved me to it from Fluxbox. But with the direction of Gnome 3 and that mess that Ubuntu is pushing “Unity” I revisited KDE, I like it, I like it allot. But the upstream bugs from Ubuntu are a real PiA and are getting worse with every release. So this movement I fully support, for it is the natural evolution of Mint maturing into it’s own distro.
Good show Clem, I’ve been with you since “Barbara”. The growth of this project and the popularity of Mint is a reflection of good decisions and direction.
Cheers –
Very important to give information about the proyect… Sometimes when there is no info, people in the forum start to ask, and there is no direct answer… Very nice guys!!!
I am LMDE fan, wating for the new spin… Any day soon?
Many, many thanks to Clem and fellow Linux Mint contributors for the advances you’re all making in each edition! Your efforts are deeply admired.
With respect to LMDE, will the installer support installing to btrfs partitions without an alternatively formatted /boot partition, now that Grub supports booting from btrfs partitions (http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/grub-devel/2011-05/msg00032.html)? I ask because a recent attempt to install Debian Testing with a btrfs /boot partition resulted in an error message saying the bootloader doesn’t support btrfs, despite Grub 1.99 being on the ISO…
@Paul: More details will surface about the Fluxbox edition when I get the new menu system implemented and working the way I want it to. Development on it is moving quickly and there’s good progress, however it’s not done just yet.
Used Debian with KDE a a couple of years ago and then changed to Ubuntu with Gnome. I would love to see Linux Mint KDE Dedian based, right now i am using Linux Mint 11 with the kubuntu desktop, and i really like it.
I am using Mint from the release of Mint 10.
First, I don’t like the direction Ubuntu is heading now. Second, I am not waiting for a pure Debian rolling release confronting us with a lot of updates. The successtory of Linux Mint is that it is easy enough for newbees and just clutterfree for people like me who wants to have everything working out of the box without any problems during the period of use.
Why not keep sticking to the Ubuntu LTS-releases and providing updated packages for the most used applications? Bodhi-linux is doing it…I am not fond of Enlightenment as a WM…but the same can be done with Gnome or KDE. I simply wants something that works stable and troublefree…is it asking too much?
Otherwise I have to go back to good old Ubuntu-LTS, or Pardus…or perhaps openSuse, just to mention a few. Always enough choice!
Very interesting how things turns. I think it’s a good decision to leave Ubuntu, they are too unpredictable and don’t have quality and reliability as goals for their products. – It’s only about forcing new releases every 6 month. 🙁
LMDE will be a really good alternative as base, when the new update system get working.
If there are some good programs/features in Ubuntu it’s still possible to recompile them for Debian and use them. (The strength of open source-code! :D)
Clem, I really like the thoughts you tell about and the ways you choose!
Go on, Thanks!
I like the thought of Mint moving toward LMDE as their main edition. Indeed, Ubuntu’s path is unclear at best, and probably not at all good. However, I must agree with those who still like the Ubuntu base. For now, I am humming along as fast as you want with Mint 9. Each time I try LMDE, I get impatient with all the crap you have to do to get it working. That’s not what kept me crawling back to mint over the years. One commenter says there are plenty of choices if Mint doesn’t accomplish what they want. Go ahead, try ’em all. I have myself. You’ll come back to mint, I promise. There are several distros that are still pretty good, and darn close in some cases. But close only counts with horse shoes, hand grenades, and dancing.
This is not to say that I’m not interested to see how LMDE develops, as I am quite giddy about it. It’s just that the LMDE team has some work to do, and I think they recognize that, which is an admirable quality. I feel certain that the LMDE will get it right, but aside from checking the website for updates such as these, I’m not investing one more second in LMDE. I don’t have the time, which is a shame, because I would really like to be able to offer more to the developers instead of just what’s wrong. Maybe one day I will.
Thanks Clem for the information. In my opinion we are tacking the right steps to the future. If Ubuntu can develop a great distro based on Debian, Linux Mint can do it to and maybe better still.
Is frustrating having regressions after an LTS as we are experiencing by being under the umbrella of Ubuntu. LMDE will free time for the devs. will be more stable and rolling updates will be pre-screened for us. Lets be patient and try to be optimistic for the new plans.
Linux Mint Really Rocks!
I’ll join my voice to the others – Clem, it’s much appreciated that you (and the team) are open about your future plans, and the reasons behind some of your decisions.
I don’t know whether the Debian Edition is the way of the future, but I trust your judgement on which way to take Mint KDE. I tend to prefer KDE, but it was Mint that made me appreciate the good points of GNOME – which is why I also plan to stay with Mint through the next version, to see what you do with GNOME 3. I definitely won’t be one of the ones to drop you…it will take a lot more than that to get rid of this happy user.
As a data point, I have discovered that a package (Dreamchess) in Debian repos seems to be just fine, while the same game in the Ubuntu repositories has had a bug for at least a year that causes the board to rotate. Who knows how many other minor quirks are introduced when Ubuntu repackages things?
The proposal for KDE sounds good. Personally I would like to see it become a rolling OS. A little less reliance on Kubuntu would be great also. My impressions of Mint are that Gnome and KDE are very good OSs.
Really appreciated post, Clem! one of the beautiful things about Mint is the plain communication between developers and users!
anyway, i’m totally agreeing KDE switch to Deb rolling release!!! i’ve been waiting it for months! 🙂
Thanks the gods for this change!
I always check the known problems pages when a new version comes out and every time, I see there’s a number of issues that I would class as show-stoppers. And they never seem to go away; that’s the problem.
This move to LMDE as a base is a good thing – faster and hopefully – without the show-stoppers! (I think Ubuntu class them as features nowdays!)
Clem the main reason I’m in favor of having Linux Mint keeping it Ubuntu Based releases is Because of Canonical certified Hard ware Program. that guarantee’s The Desk top or Lap top I buy will Work with Ubuntu or any of its Off shoots like Linux Mint. However if Mint gos pure Debian I won’t know if that Next H.P or Dell desk top I buy will work with Linux Mint Debian when I try to install it Clem. O.K in my opinion I believe there’s room for Both A Linux Mint Debian and Linux Mint versions based on Ubuntu.
Looking forward to the AMD64 version of LMDE!
Clem, first of all, thanks for the great work!
I use Mint since Elyssa, and I have been there for a long time, until recently, because it was the last one which worked well on my old laptop with an ATI video card (and hell it worked great, the best linux ever on this machine!). Now I’m very excited to move to LMDE on my new laptop. For me it is great as it is now, and anyone can feel how much care and effort you guys have put in this one.
However, adding to some comments I have read on other posts, I would really love to see LMDE following Debian stable as default, with the option to follow Debian testing. It could be an option in the installer, maybe. That way, many folks out there would be pleased to appreciate all the polish that comes from Mint together with the robustness and ease of mint that comes from Debian stable (no trouble with game-changing updates), I think it make a flawless combo.
Anyway, I wish all the best to Mint development, keep up the great work!
The idea building KDE on Debian base is really good. I think it would be lot less buggier, faster and less memory consuming. Canonical has never worked Kubuntu (KDE) so hard than regular Ubuntu(Gnome).
Mint Main editions should only be LXDE and Gnome edition. Others should be Debian based. I think it makes it also easier to manage.
I have using PCLOS system (1 of my computers) and KDE rolling release is great. KDE is improving really quick and get stuck with old KDE is real pain. Ubuntu repo updating for new KDE could break the system (I have had 2 times that accident).
Two thumbs up for LMDE KDE. Just keep it rolling.
Thanks for the great work you and the team are doing, Clem, and thanks for the update. I am a solid KDE fan and am intrigued by the idea of an LMDE KDE version. Fully expecting to be flamed, I have to say to some of the posters, “Quit your whining and make a contribution! You know who you are.”
Linux Mint is an amazing distro. Keep up the good work
Looking forward for the new iso of LMDE – as I am still witing for an option to encrypt /home during installation process, as original DEBIAN offers it.
But maybe that’s just me as newbie… 😉
Is a good idea work only Ubuntu LTS versions. And 10.04.1, 10.04.2, 10.04.3 always updating the programs.
Save time, money, headache.
And is it asking too much for to ask come back the universal version? Not all countries have a good Internet.
Debian is a solid and progressive GNU/Linux distro – one of the orginals. With that as it’s base, Mint can only get better.
I personally have never told anyone that I was a Windows user since WFW3.11 (That’s Windows For Workgroups), it’s been the last 6-8 years that I had been experimenting with Linux…..I had tried OpenSuse, Mandriva, Fedora & Ubuntu…even tried Kubuntu but nothing seem to catch my intrest until Linux Mint. I had heard so much about it, that I figured why not give it a try. Low & behold, it has been my main distro in use on a dual boot HDD with, you guessed it, W7….though I only go to the Windows side occasionally just to keep up on the updates, but I’m really enjoying Mint KDE. If Boo & Clem want to colaberate on making use of an LMDE based kde version of Mint….I think that would be fine, since KDE devs have left out certain functions of the laptop touchpads after 4.5.4……once 4.6.0 came out. I just tried the LMDE version and had all functionality of my touchpad…..so I’m thrilled about this….keep up the great work Boo & Clem….if there’s anything I could do to help…
I’m using Mint as a desktop daily. It always has better user experience and hardware experience. Good jobs, guy! Now, I’m trying LMDE, but it always breaks. Debain testing provides newer software, but it is not stable enough! Therefore, I would like to suggest Mint Debian team switching the repository from testing to stable!
Talking about LMDE installer, something that’s missing is raid and lvm. Hope that it will happen in the near future
Thanks again
@Carlos Felipe: No one is stopping you from using Kubuntu, installing the themes/icons for past Linux Mint KDE releases, and tweaking the little things to mimic the look. I did that with LXDE on my LMDE machine and it looks almost the same as Mint 11 LXDE. Granted, its not as optimized as Mint 11 LXDE, but at least the functionality is close enough for me to not run into many problems.
Moving to the Debian base with the tested update packs helps me a lot because I do a lot of programming and would rather not format my OS every 6 months and setup my settings all over again like I would with Ubuntu. I do understand that there are LTS versions and while I use 10.04 LTS for my web server, I like more up to date programs on my desktop.
Clem & Team: Much better to make sure it’s all stable before committing to a release! This is just ONE of the many reasons I’m a Mint evangelist. Consistently you guys have made decisions that directly benefit the end user. Consistently pushing the envelope and improving the upstream situation even while Ubuntu goes crazy and makes decisions that are bad for everybody. Can’t wait for the new LMDE. Any word on a replacement for Brasero? That’s pretty much the only thing that has been broken in every version of Mint I’ve installed. And Ubuntu.
I think what you are doing guys is fantastic job i want to appreciate what you are doing
Please, please, please! make the KDE edition based on Debian! I want a KDE notebook and a KDE home server!
and please test the ad-hoc sharing internet connection too!
I am also among the users who think that the future of LMDE is to be build on solid Debian base. THe various repos will allow each individual to balance their up-to-date/stability balance by moving from latest/incoming or even stick to stable debian.
I understand the concern of one who is concerned of loss in stability by moving to rolling release but I think the opposite: LMDE latest will offer more stability than a ubuntu base which is upgraded each 6 months. The more users/testers/feedback we will have for LMDE and the more stabilized will be the latest repos (for the ones who like stability).
I also think that trying to have ubuntu base and Debian base version of LM would creat an unnecessary split of efforts. I guess the team will be much more efficient if concentrating his effort on debian version of gnome/kde/lxde …..
LMDE is a fairly new project and I think it is already the top debian based distribution. Just in oreder to avoid troll I want to say that I also like ubuntu a lot, I think they did some great things for linux (amazing installer / hardware recognition / great support) but Ubuntu is just not my taste and I would like to see LMDE take his own path.
Whatever the direction taken, I want to say a big thank you to all the development team !!
I would like Mint KDE wth Debian base.
For installing proprietary drivers maybe you should take a look in the smxi project.
http://smxi.org/
Maybe this can help.
As long as Debian has no working installer for the restricted drivers, please don’t change the KDE-Flavour of MINT to it.
MINT is known till now as one of the most user friendliest distros, that works out of the box. Please don’t gamble that good name away. Pushing the envelope is fine, but
pushing the envelope to fast, is letting a lot of users behind. I don’t think this should be the goal.
I’ve tried five different distros of Linux and Mint is the very best by far! My only wish when installing it from a DVD was that I was given the option to erase the entire disk and replace it w/Mint…I had the hardest time with the partition section (and still stuck with Jolicloud on my system). If this option was added, Mint would be absolutely perfect!!! Thanks!
@schemer Says:
“Debian is a solid and progressive GNU/Linux distro”
hahaha stable, right? you MUST be an advanced user (or intermediate user) for to use Debian, to circumvent any unforeseen, mainly the Debian Testing.
And Ubuntu is a linux for human beings, a easy system.
In the world we have more advanced/intermediate users or novice users from other operating systems? […]
Can’t wait for the KDE edition. After Unity and GNOME 3 disasters KDE has lately become my favourite Linux desktop.
Does LMDE have blobs or proprietary drivers in its kernel? The reason why I hesitate using LMDE is because Debian does not work out-of-the-box in my Compaq Presario CQ61 due to its kernel stripped of proprietary drivers. If LMDE has the complete version of the Linux kernel, I would immediately switch to it.
@ Carlos Felipe:
Yes yes yes, we have understood that you are a Ubuntu-fan. But it’s enough now!
Lots of people here feels like me, that Ubuntu is too unstable and has much too low quality ambitions to base a HIGH quality Mint-release on.
@ Carlos Felipe:
Ubuntu managed to do a friendly linux distribution based on Debain, we are many to believe that Linux Mint will manage to do an even better one. Now they just take 2 different paths we slightly different philosophies. Maybe some Linux Mint user (you may be one of them…) will decide to switch back to Ubuntu due to this change but I believe a lot of Ubuntu users (and others) will be attracted by a solid-roling-debian-based-user-friendly-mint-flavored distribution ….
@ Carlos Felipe: obviously you’re entitled to your opinion, but as a long time Ubuntu user, i beg to differ since Mark Shuttleworth has clearly other plans for Ubuntu than keeping the “Desktopers” on board.
Even though LMDE is clearly not ready for Prime time (proprietary drivers are a deal-breaker for me), it is the future for Mint as a way to be independant from Mark Shuttleworth’s future Shenanigans.
Clem is clearly both conscious and cautious not to keep all his eggs in the same nest, and trying to move a heavy KDE env in Debian is a good try.
Just my to cents but any KDE ubuntu based sucks big time, to slooow (been trying since Unity & Gnome 3 are out).
@ Clem
LMDE is my future distro when the proprietary drivers issue will be solved.
Will you include the workaround found by Phoronix related to the execessive power consumption of Linux kernels of late ?
I.E “pcie_aspm=force” cf ref : http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=linux_2638_aspm&num=3
LMDE + KDE + update packs = best distro ever !
Clem thank you for your hard work!
Count me as another who says a Debian base is the future. Ubuntu is going more and more away from its simple/clean Debian roots.
Support Linux Mint by disabling your ad blocker for linuxmint.com and the forums. Click on ads to help support Linux Mint. Cheers,
This is why I love Linux Mint! Always doing things the most sensible way.
Now, that said, I can understand Carlos Felipe’s concerns. If I was solidly using the KDE edition, I wouldn’t like this decision, either, as I’ve not had very good experiences with LMDE yet. It is getting better, but not quite ready for full-time use yet.
The issues for me are the limited hardware support (esp. with proprietary drivers), which Clem just said is being addressed, and the lacking in some software areas. What I mean by that is that with Ubuntu, there are easy-to-use PPA’s for just about anything out there. With Debian, you have to find repositories, which often don’t exist for a lot of newer or proprietary software, then manually install GPG keys, which isn’t very user-friendly. And often, if you can find a .deb file for something, it’s for Ubuntu and you take a steep risk trying to install it on a Debian distro.
Those are the only things preventing me from using LMDE. I would probably not be happy if forced to use it. Hopefully those things will all be addressed and fixed in the near future, because I love the *idea* of LMDE getting us away from Ubuntu’s junky releases lately and ending the annoying 6-month reinstall. It’s just not feasible in practice yet, at least for me.
That said, what’s stopping Carlos Felipe from installing the Main (Gnome/Ubuntu-based) distro, and replacing Gnome with KDE?
@ Mike Freeman
what’s stopping Carlos Felipe from installing the Main (Gnome/Ubuntu-based) distro, and replacing Gnome with KDE?
The answer is performance, i don’t know if it is the packages or configuration, but the KDE implementation from Ubuntu is not in par with the others distro…
Regarding proprietary nvidia drivers, all you have to do, is to download 4-5 packages from synaptic and run command (nvidia-xconfig). Which packages? Depends on your card. In my case,
nvidia-xconfig
nvidia-glx
nvidia-kernel common
nvidia-settings
“In the world we have more advanced/intermediate users or novice users from other operating systems? ”
Each to his own. They are not such a thing as “novice user”. But they are people which want to remain “novice users” -aka, learn one or two things and stay there.
The more you learn, the more help you can offer
@ Mike Freeman:
“The answer is performance, i don’t know if it is the packages or configuration, but the KDE implementation from Ubuntu is not in par with the others distro…”
Then it’s quite clear, Ubuntu is NOT a good base for Linux Mint KDE.
Instead of trying to repair a miss-performing Ubuntu it’s better to use resources to adopt LMDE to KDE. If Clem fixes the remaining issues in LMDE he has his own stable base, fitting for all Mint-distributions if he wants. I think that would be easier to maintain without all new problems coming every 6 month with Ubuntu.
Sorry, # 70 should have been addressed to “jediafr” NOT “M Freeman”.
Though I’m linux mint main edition user (Julia), I like the decision.
Look guys, its hard to maintain all editions based Ubuntu in current situation where Gnome/Unity massive change is going on.
I suggest every spin based on LMDE i.e LMDE Gnome, LMDE LXDE, LMDE KDE, LMDE XFCE.And you guys may decide include E17 and fluxbox to LMDE spin later. So that keeping track and every 6 month Ubuntu dependency would be over and there would not be any hurry.
And, for the NEWBIE pals like me, the main edition forking from ubuntu’s latest edition, with wubi. That also be helpful to the dev team to give much time on main edition.
What you think, guys?
J.A. Cosquets idea of an no-internet-live-cd is nice
and for the repo I would prefer your Update-Pack-Idea.
As only Live CD in mind, you may able to make it more operational to the content:
1) Font-Folder-shrink to Arial, Calibri, NY Times.. for CD.
2) gconf-editor (gpm lock) disable hibernate and suspend by default.
3) Delete stuff like your own .opera -Folder before you make an final iso without opera.
4) Please do not power off the display by default in the upcoming live CDs.
Thanks for keeping us up-to-date, Clem. As usual, your wise, patient, step-by-step, keep-it-stable, keep-up-the-quality, long-term outlook is much appreciated. Great work in planning and execution, Clem & Team. Keep it up.
Seeing that “Improving the way people install proprietary drivers” is a top priority is excellent news.
As far as tracking Debian stable, can’t you just point your
/etc/apt/sources.list
to
deb http://ftp.debian.org/debian squeeze main contrib non-free
?
See:
http://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?f=141&t=71476&p=416624#p416624
for a more thorough conversation.
“As you may have heard, the future of the Mandriva Linux distribution is unclear.”
Do you remember? Now I say, the future of the Linux Mint distribution is unclear, now I feel obliged to change, c’est la vie, maybe Caixa Mágica 16 KDE or Big Linux 11.04 RC2, both based on kubuntu 11.04.
For me, Debian’s users they don’t use distros based in others, they want to have the control. Ubuntu’s users they don’t care and yet they like easier still.
I’ll be watching now, silent, and and I desire good luck for Clem and your team.
Regarding the possibility of Linux Mint KDE switching to a LMDE base…
Do it.
I will wait.
Dude seriously … we get it. You’re not happy. You want an Ubuntu base. Your sniveling is noted. Now … move on.
I support the direction of heading towards a Debian based Linux Mint. Canonical is taking Ubuntu off in its own direction and it’s time for Linux Mint to carve its own path as well. My hardware functions well with LMDE. Great leadership Clem and fantastic work, Linux Mint team!
Really looking forward to the possibility of a LMDE-based Mint KDE! I’d like to add my voice to those requesting the option to encrypt /home and preferably the option to do a full disk encryption on all mint OSes. I’m forced to use ubuntu on my work laptop for the combination of full disk encryption and hardware support. A full-encryption LMDE would be ace… I know it’s doable now via a workaround but I’m no pro and my laptop must be reliable.
I’ve come back to Mint, I wandered off- mint is too good- I missed the tinkering and challenges . now I just want to use it and mint is the best flavor by far…and it is even better than before, brilliant.. but I still like and use my first mint desktop for nostagia, the one with the raindrops on the windscreen and moody green thunder clouds !
Im using Kubuntu today but a rolling KDE version of Mint based on Debian tomorrow would be even more awesome!
Please make a LMDE-KDE!!!
I also like the idea of no-internet-live-cd and the idea of install DVD with different DE-s.
asymmetros Says:
July 12th, 2011 at 4:48 pm
Regarding proprietary nvidia drivers, all you have to do, is to download 4-5 packages from synaptic and run command (nvidia-xconfig). (…)
They are not such a thing as “novice user”.
But they are people which want to remain “novice users” -aka, learn one or two things and stay there. (…)
/asymmetros says
@ asymmetros
for you maybe the purpose of a linux distro is tinkering in it. But for a lot of people, I’m one of them, the purpose of a linux distro is working, surfing, gaming e.t.c..
For that till now Linux Mint Gnome and KDE was the best.
But if Mint is changing to a distro where you have to tinker to get it working, it will lose of it’s popularity.
Internet Should be there form live cd or dvd if not cd exactly….accessing internet for torubleshooting is VERY VITAL..
@asymmetros regarding not having to tinker with a kde version of LMDE as compared to the kubuntu based version, i would say it would depend a great deal on how well Clem’s new monthly updater directly from mint repos (instead of daily direct from debian) will work out….
It could end up being about as good or not as good…only feedback after it’s being used will answer that question…
Also, a big advantage of all versions being on LMDE is that Clem has more people to work with him directly on it, which he does not have now…therefore, a better chance to make all the debian based distros running as smooth and polished as possible…
oops…sorry…my last post was directed @ hamburn
those comments were for you…
I personally use Linux Mint 11 Gnome because of KDE slow performance. Devian is a great OS and Linux Mint should be more geared toward a Devian core than Ubuntu. You are doing a great Job and Linux Mint is a very nice, fast, attractive OS. Fist time I tried it and it was the hook to the best Linux experience I’ve had in the last 6 years. Great Job!!!
re comment 63 from leslie
Have you tried gparted to delete the Joli cloud partition. download gparted, you have to be very careful to positively identify which partition Jolicloud is inhabiting -as you don’t want to delete partitions you require. There is plenty of help on gparted so read up
about how to use it first. Go Mint !
I love the idea of switching Mint KDE over to the Debian base. I have LMDE installed on one of my partitions but I’d gladly switch that over to LMDE KDE if (when) it’s released. As a rule, I like KDE better than Gnome but Mint 10 KDE had too many issues for me to use it as a day-to-day operating system, I don’t think a Debian-based Mint KDE will have those issues. 🙂
In general, the movement to LMDK is not as surprising as the move to keep LXDE Ubuntu-based. Considering how quickly XFCE was adapted, I would have expected to see that one move to Debian first. But my buddy will be very happy with this, he has been a Kubuntu user since 9.10 and really has problems with 11.04. I’ve already conviced him to move to LMDK once it gets produced.
in Ukraine mainly distributed unlimited internet access, which they brought to even small villages. LMDE so has no problems in my country with updates. I set LMDE my friends in the Crimea, and they are moving away from Windows, saying that LMDE – it’s simple, beautiful and reliably!
Good luck, team Mint!
LMDE and problems with proprietary drivers? I have no problems at all. Using AMD GPU here, FGLRX modules. All I did was apt-get.
Oh, and about Carlos Felipe’s comments. Advanced users won’t necessarily use pure debian because of control. I have LPI Level 2 certification and use mind debian. I also used ubuntu for a long time. Heck, Linus Torvalds uses Fedora, not “Linux from a scratch” as some would think.
The idea of linux mint debian edition is prety good. Newer plans for LMDE are even better. Nice thinking guys.
The latest Ubuntu has failed at the partitioners lack of ability to mount partitions where you want to. I surely hope this has been addressed. I’ve turned users onto Mint for awhile, and have been happy to do it, but this latest that still uses the Ubuntu basic installer package has that damn partitioner problem in it – so I don’t use it and stick with an earlier version, hoping this gets adressed. As soon as it does, I’ll be cutting Mint CD versions for all my friends.
Hmm, given the Mint team being pulled more and more towards Debian, I may as well move to #!
Have been with mint since gloria and only fooled around with some other distros. I’m no expert and copy-paste console commands when they are necessary. I switched to LMDE as soon as it was out because of the increased bulkyness and glitches of ubuntu (-base). And really, I rarely had to tinker with LMDE (only occasional issues with video playback – and what the heck, install xine and you’re fine). It’s really a stable and confortable edition. Now I always preferred some kde-apps (k3b and kaffeine), but still don’t trust KDE4 much – I probably won’t like gmone3 either -, so getting KDE4 on a proper and tested mint-debian basis could be a real treat. You’re on a good way, mint Team, Clem, thanks for an already very good time with a great OS, I’ll stay on board.
It’s sad to see that one of the best linux distro’s (Mint based on Ubuntu) is slowly fading away.
It has worked very good for me, from mint 5 up to mint 10.
I am not a computer expert, and i cannot get a Debian based Mint installed properly. I tried it already more than 10 times, and always something going wrong: Mint doesn’t see the swap, i cannot get the partitions right, or it all goes wrong with the strange questions in the updates.
This is extremely frustrating.
I don’t understand why everybody is so enthusiastic about a truly great distro disappearing, and being replaced by something that doesn’t have the same user friendliness by far.
I understand your frustrations … the installer is flawed, that’s why they’re tackling it next. We aren’t enthusiastic about Mint disappearing … we’re enthusiastic because with this chance, Mint can remain. Ubuntu is shifting in a direction that is horrible and incompatible with the Mint way of life, and going back to the roots with Debian allows them to keep doing what they do best.
It is still a flawed distro right now because it is in transition … the installer is not nearly as good as the main edition, proprietary drivers are very difficult to install, and the textual boot makes it look unfinished. That said, huge strides are made VERY quickly (such as the new update system), and all of those obstacles are temporary. Once it is caught up, it WILL be better than the main edition, and just as user-friendly. Keep the faith my friend.
@bruno, I make your words my words.
@LifeInTheGrey, we have faith, LMDE will be very good, but not for all like Ubuntu, to another public, a sect yes.
It would be amazing to have a LMDE-based Linux Mint KDE. I love KDE, but I am tired of re-installing the entire system every 6 months. I think that Linux Mint would become a truly KDE reference distribution within few weeks.
I do not have a preference for either an ubuntu or a debian-based Mint. I need stability and out of the box functionality followed by performance. I have a small business running 3 LinuxMint 10 KDE machines and a WinXP machine. I do not have the time or knowledge to fiddle with an OS or an application. I need stability, so which ever route you go, I will keep on supporting Mint as long as it is stable and will work out of the box on all my machines.
@Carlos Felipe: So much for a watch, silently from within the shadows…
@everyone who hate the idea of moving to Debian base… Guess what? Ubuntu is based on Debian… Really, no shit here! And guess what? They did some tweaks to make it user friendlier!!! 😀 Yeah I know hard to believe!
So, what makes you think the same can’t be achieved by the Linux Mint team? I know this is not about reinventing the wheel, it’s about letting Mint stay in its path even if Ubuntu moves away from that path.
I am a LMDE user for a bit over a year and even though there’s been breakages with some updates, all I had to do is click on the “Fix Broken Packages” button in Synaptic… Really! they have a button or menu for everything so you don’t have to actually learn anything new! 😀
@Carlos Felipe once again… Mi estimado, no te caerian mal unas clasecitas de ingles… Digo, para entenderte y que te entiendan los demas hermanos anglos 😉
The one thing I don’t like about Mint (though not LMDE) is that during the boot phase none of the kernel messages are shown. Is there a way to allow this to spill out onto the screen? When the counter expires for the number of times the system has been booted without checking the disk drives and FSCK runs I often don’t see the percent done, and if I do it’s ONLY for one of the partitions. I often HAVE to hit the “C” key repeatedly before the system will boot, it does seem to hang on completing the FSCK check. (This on mint “9” gnome). Would be better to see the kernel status lines during boot.
Yeah! Change the KDE edition to LMDE, Kubuntu is a bad joke (stupid bugs every version).
Hello Mint team, Mint KDE has been my full time distro for some time and I greatly appreciate it. I would be delighted to try a LMDE KDE and welcome the idea of a rolling distro with Mint’s goals and features.
I would love to see the KDE edition based on Debian. 🙂
@Scott #! is based on Debian too…
@90 ,hamburn Says:
July 13th, 2011 at 8:56 am
” …@ asymmetros
for you maybe the purpose of a linux distro is tinkering in it. But for a lot of people, I’m one of them, the purpose of a linux distro is working, surfing, gaming e.t.c…. ”
No. First of all, you missed my phrase: “The more you learn, the more help you can offer”
I spoke here for help (thus and for community). I did noy say “The more you learn, the more you understand Linux or controll your system, or anything like this.
A novice user, is unaware of the fact that he can install 3d drivers by a simple click. Then, he learns it. This knowledge, does not make him geeky.
He learns also how to install packages from synaptic. Not a geeky yet -but he feels less “novice” than before.
After all, if you explain him which packages to install from synaptic in order to have his 3d drivers -this is not the end of the world! And this, does not make him geeky!
PS: Computers must help us for education, communication, work, amusement, watching movies, listening songs. For me, Linux is the best way to run a computer
I echo J.A. Cosquet’s wish for a no-internet-installation option. His arguments are equally valid here in Niger.
@J.A. Cosquet: how do you spin the repositories onto dvd:s?
Count me as another who would love to see an E-17 spin of Mint on a Debian base. That would be my dream distro.
@ Raidensub:
For installing proprietary drivers maybe you should take a look in the smxi project.
I couldn’t agree more.
Thanks Clem and gang for all your hard work.
@LifeInTheGrey: What is so horrible about what Canonical is doing? What is incompatible about Ubuntu that is counter to a “Mint way of life?” I think bruno is just worried about a broader user base being alienated because of Mint becoming an elegant Debian.
@Carlos Felipe I was reading the entire thing. It seems you want Ubuntu and Kubuntu based but not Ubuntu and Kubuntu themselves. Could that be because some of their radical changes made your systems unstable? I see you are asking Clem to give up new technology and develop an outdated OS as his MAIN OS. That would forever be OUTDATED. However I understand your complaint too. Try puppylinux. Its Ubuntu based and runs well on 486 machines with 128MB of ram so I’m sure its a fit for the mountains. Load it to a live USB drive and install all you could want there there’s highspeed net then take the drive to the rural areas and install it by booting to it then installing to hard drive. I think you’ll be happy with that.
@Bruno Its not that we are all happy to see it go. You and Carlos are ignoring that Ubuntu is moving away from their user friendly base and onto Unity. Try UnityLinux, thats the future of Ubuntu and what you are both begging Mint to be like. When Ububtu changes what its based on, all Ubuntu based systems will change too. As an example, I got LMDE to install fine, tried Unity, ended up pullin my hair out and it still never worked after 3 days of trying. THATS the Ubuntu you want us to follow.
I think it’s wonderful. It seems very happy, and that makes me happy. I installed it on a very modest computer and it’s working perfectly. I am very happy with the Menu feature. Thank you so much!
hi all,
i believe LM hasn’t a hybrid iso so we could simply do a $cat lmde.iso >/dev/sdx ; are you guys thinking about that?
i am having problems to create an usb installer pen.
Hey Boo/Clem,
I’m a big fan of Linux Mint KDE. You guys have done an outstanding job so far.
As much as I love Debian (I use it for most of my servers), I’m hesitant for you to replace the Kubuntu Base. I myself use a lot of external repositories that are built for Ubuntu and my office users need it for work. If the switch happened, i think we’ll need to switch back to Kubuntu.
Is it not possible to have both like the Gnome Desktop? Is this a man/power resource issue?
If this is the case, can you create a requirements list for whats needed for running both? Perhaps I maybe of assistance, I’ve been a Linux Sysadmin for the past 10 years.
Cheers,
Zubin
I’m following you closely. I’m a KDE fan, and I am now tracking Fedora KDE Unstable repositories, so I have KDE 4.7 RC2. The packaging is great, but I won’t have time anymore to maintain the system, and I’ll have to settle. So I come to you.
What’s the current state of LMDE with KDE? Is it installable? Does it require lots of time maintaining it? How is the package quality compared to Ubuntu? I’ve used almost any distro under the sun (including Ubuntu), but I never tried Debian. How is it? What can you offer me, as a somewhat experienced Linux user, but Debian newbie?
Will there ever be a Tablet version of Mint?
I’m running LMDE on one of my desktops and my laptop, only laptop
issue is the very poor touchpad support. Using a mouse the system is
perfect, touchpad not so good.
All LMDE so desperately needs it an easier way to install drivers. I have to so that as remarkable LMDE maybe, the driver issue always has me abonding my attempts at a native install. I’m really hoping for this feature.
I loved running LMDE, I moved over to LMDE (Gnome) after I had a large kernel panic on my Arch setup. It was awesome and so fast, one of my favourite distro’s of all time.
Regarding issues, and why I’m back on Linux Mint 9 Gnome now… A few little things didn’t work on my laptop – the pc speaker always beeped, I looked everywhere for a fix and couldn’t crack it (even after using Arch! But I was pretty busy and didn’t try hard enough).
The sound was not quite as loud as I’d liked it to be and it didn’t seem to like me using my Logitech USB headset, it wasn’t as easy as Mint 9 ubuntu base, for example
Finally, what brought me away from it was when I updated I got the tty1 screen, due the the recent MESA driver update. I had a ton of work to do so I just went back to Mint 9. Didn’t have the time to fix it…
All that said, it was simply AWESOME, I loved how it was so damn fast on my laptop. I was delighted, and since I’ve read about the non-testing “tired and tested” repos, I’ll be sure to load it back up and get those running… But perhaps I’ll wait for the KDE version, as I’ve love to check that out, been trying to move over to KDE and drop gnome, but I always come back 🙂 maybe Mint KDE Debian will finally win me over 😉
“K Scharf Says:
July 14th, 2011 at 4:09 pm
The one thing I don’t like about Mint (though not LMDE) is that during the boot phase none of the kernel messages are shown.”
You can switch from splash screen by pushing F1 or ESC during boot (I can’t remember which it is but definitely one of those works).
Mint isn’t the only distro to do it that way.
I installed Debian gnome via virtual box on to my computer and I found out That is was not Ubuntu I like so much it was The Gnome Desk top That I really liked Now to me Gnome works better for what I need more so than K.D.E Xfce, flox Box. For one thing, I can down load Linux Distros with ease using Gnome. the other desk top were nothing but trouble when it came to down loading. Another thing I find easy with Gnome is, I can create Folders and Files with a few clicks with my mouse. Therefore I’m concluding That no mater if Linux Mint keeps Ubuntu or gos pure Debian it will make no difference to me so long as they still have Gnome available as one of their choices of Desk Tops.
@josefg ….you download all the repos from:
http://cdimage.debian.org/debian-cd/6.0.2.1/i386/iso-dvd/
and then use from the DVD adding them from synaptic-software sources
it’s not ideal but it will work if anything extra is needed.
Well, I download and install LMDE xfce in my netbook this week, the file copy was so slowly, and the kernel 2.6.32, xfce 4.6.
Download 700 or more MB of updates. It was not easy. Finaly I get a really responsive, good looking OS for my atom n450 netbook.
I use Linux mint kde 10.10 in my desktop, because is the best kde distro of ever.
And I agree Kubuntu 11.04= is really slow, it feels like vista. Ubuntu Unity is slow, compared con Fedora 15 Genome 3.
There are no kde 4.6 debian good distro.
But you need to port ubiquity to debian, or make a new installer for LMDE. And a tool of remastering, like mylivecd of Pclinuxos, or garfio from Tuquito(ubuntu derived). Because remastersys no functions in LMDE.
The garfio remastering tool repository is ppa:paquetes-tuquito/universal
I would definitely recommend to come up with a LMDE-KDE edition rather than a Linux Mint KDE 11 RC. In my opinion LMDE is an excellent project with great potential and the possibility of merging KDE with LMDE is something I really would like to see! Good day to all of you!
You have definitely a new faithful subscriber if you release an LMDE KDE version. It’s indeed exactly what I’m looking for and I’m sure many other people would agree:
– Debian base : robust & community distro ; no waste of resource by reinventing the weel
– Debian testing : rolling release…
– Update packs : … with less chance to break than a regular rolling release
– Mint : user friendly & funded by the community ; handy tools + relevant Ubuntu patches
– KDE : state of the art / innovative desktop environment while keeping the tried and true desktop paradigm
This would definitely be the *best* combination and is badly needed considering the recent regressions in Ubuntu, the issues raised by Gnome 3 and Unity, the fact that KDE distros are getting rare ! Go go go ! 😉
It wouldnt hurt to see kde go a different direction,so im all for it
I have moved from Ubuntu 7 years ago, to Linux Mint 4 years ago and @ 1 year now, I have been using LMDE on several computers, the latest being a 2015 iMac 21”. Thank you for the work you have been doing.It has worked well on my HP 8300 Desktop, Late 2020 APPLE macbook Air, Acer One, a Dell Latitude. I am a Pastor and since 1995 I have used a microsoft based program called Online Bible that I never could load on a linux based OS until LMDE. I loaded Wine, and Play on Linux and it has loaded and ran well on 2 computers. Thank you again for your work. I vote for LMDE and hope it stays around for awhile.